Episode 136: Behind the Scenes of Event Success: Planning, Production, and Promotion [featuring Steve Turney]

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Transcript

PATRICK CASALE: Hey, everyone. You are listening to another episode of the All Things Private Practice podcast. I'm joined today by Steve Turney, who I'm really excited to have on because he is the executive director of the Mental Health Marketing Conference.

And we are going to talk about planning, production, and promotion, the three P's of events, and event planning.

So, Steve, thanks for coming on. I know you just got done with your Mental Health Marketing Conference of 2023. It was a success. And I'm excited to talk about this because this is a subject that I love. And you do a really good job with putting on something really unique to the mental health community. And a lot of people listening may not even know that it exists. So, thanks for being here.

STEVE TURNEY: Patrick, thanks for having me on. I'm excited to talk with you about this. And thank you. Yeah, it did just wrap… it feels like it wrapped yesterday. And then I look back, you know, we're kind of two months out right now. And depending on when this airs, may be longer. So, it's amazing how time flies.

So, I'm actually in urgent planning mode again for '24 because you just can't rest on the laurels, you know? We got some nice feedback, of course, and some good ideas for how to do it better. But, man, yeah, time slips away.

PATRICK CASALE: It's such a good point that I was mentioning to you before we started hitting record. And the reason I like the topic you suggested is because you and I have had to reschedule on each other's podcasts a couple of times, me because my voice, and time, and whatever. And I was like, "Oh, that's a good idea, this suggestion."

And there's a part of planning where, like, promotion immediately starts after one event ends. And I think a lot of people don't really see that side of things or understand the logistics, and the emotional labor that goes in behind the scenes when you're planning a big event.

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, it is an emotional lift. And the promotion side bleeds into the other aspects of production and planning. So, that's kind of the rubric that I've been working with to help myself get organized about what are the big buckets that I need to be thinking about when I schedule or plan an event? And then who do I know around me that does it way better than I do?

So, there's a guy, Jared Egli, in Nashville, who does my audio and video. He's kind of my event producer. And I can never do what he does. But you know, we do high-definition video recordings for our mainstage stuff. And the reason for that is twofold. One is that we can host it after the fact for attendees to watch back so you don't have to feel like you have to memorize every last thing you can revisit. And there's something amazing about repetition. How much that happens? You know, it depends on the individual attendee.

But two, in today's social media world and vertical video world, you know, I know you have Austin Armstrong come into your Italy, Doubt Yourself, Do It Anyway event. And he's an amazing resource on that. And he's taught me a lot about the importance of having something compelling on social media.

And for us, I can take these videos and use an AI tool to chop them up into 30-second sound bites, and then all of a sudden my promotion is happening on the back end of my event, which is just so refreshing because as you know, you come off of that, and I'm just maxed. I don't know how you are after an event.

PATRICK CASALE: Maxed is an understatement, I think. It's like one of those things where you are riding this emotional high in a way because all the culmination of the planning, and the prep, and the logistical stuff that can sometimes be a nightmare, if I'm being honest, comes to an end. And you're kind of met with this like, okay, relief feeling, right? Also, a situation where let me try to take it in and be proud of this event.

And then your mindset is very similar to mine because you are like, I'm already having to, like, start figuring out the kinks from this year and getting ready to promote next year. And it does feel like this kind of vicious cycle in a way.

But if you get the story piece down, like you mentioned, I do think it makes for a smoother process in the startup, the planning, the production phases, so that promotion then gets easier over time because I'm sure your first conference was probably a bit messier than this one.

STEVE TURNEY: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Our PowerPoint situation was a hot mess, partly our fault, partly the venue had just, you know, some of those things that happen and you have to be ready for those ghosts in the system to pop up. But the more you can get ahead of it…

And you're somebody I remember, you know, our conversation, something I took away from an early conversation is, this is someone who does things with excellence, you know? And sometimes you just have to simply ship the work at a certain point, of course, but you do things with excellence, which means you're probably thinking, you know, and I try to strive for that, which is just about as soon as things are over I'm thinking about how to do it better next year, you know? Whatever the approval rating is, how can we improve that, and the value of the conference, and the experience? You know?

And I think that's a pretty high ceiling, you know? I don't think I'm touching it yet. But I think we're focused on that.

So, yeah, with the promotion side to systematize and have a process for it, you know. And also, you know, you've got great people around you, I'm thinking about the great people around me and adding a few more. One will be definitely like social media management, you know? Because that's something that takes up a lot of our time internally. It's really important, but it's like, maybe not the highest value of how I'm wired to be thinking about, you know, the future, and thinking about the agenda. That's where my head is at because when I think about the planning P, which is like my first P and probably yours, too, it's about shipping value and that's typically expertise.

So, you know, you have like Gabrielle Juliano-Villani and you've got Austin Armstrong at this Italy event that's sold out for a reason. I mean, there's a waitlist but sold out for a reason because the content for me is the core. Like, if you split the oak tree right down to the middle of the center circle is the experts that I can bring to the table and not just have them be inaccessible experts, but have it be something that the community can connect with those people in meaningful ways that works for everybody.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, absolutely. And thank you for the compliments, too. I do strive for it. And I think it's hard because I am someone who definitely struggles with perfectionism, which I work on every day. And I always am thinking about how can we improve?

And that's just not what it is. Like, you should see the after soccer games, after our adult league soccer games. If we lose a tournament game night, we'll think about it, and ruminate, like, "Could we have [INDISCERNIBLE 00:08:41] differently? Could we have tried tactics differently?" Like, it's just always how my mindset has been, which helps a lot when planning has become a big part of your life.

And I'm a planner by nature. So, like I plan all of our vacations, I plan all the logistics, all the trips that I take myself, with my wife, with my friends. They kind of default to that. And a lot of it is fun. Like, I do enjoy figuring these things out. But some of it is just natural ability.

And I think you're right, like planning comes down to, like, the values behind what you're trying to accomplish.

And for me and for you because I hear it when you say it, I want people to come to these events and take away something special. Like, I want it to not only be worth the money because money is important, but time for entrepreneurs is probably the most important currency that we have and the one that we don't get back.

And if someone's willing to take a few days off work or step away from their day-to-day, and travel to something that I'm putting on or putting you're putting on, I want them to come away and say, "I want to do that again. And I want to tell my friends and my colleagues about this because it was so helpful for me."

And I am willing all the time in I planning to sacrifice a lot of the profit in order to ensure that the experience is top notch.

And you mentioned Italy, like, it's probably the craziest thing I've ever done or planned in my life. I'm very thankful to have a great business partner and friend in this. But I want people to come away thinking like, "I spent a lot of money to get to this middle-of-nowhere mountaintop village in Italy and it was worth every single cent and more, not just financially, but emotionally." Because travel is also exhausting. And we have to step away from our lives, our families, potentially, your kids, your pets, you know, airports, etc., it better be worth the cost of admission, in my opinion.

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, yeah. I just went to a conference in Arizona at the Behavioral Health Tech conferences put on by Soleme Tibebu. And it's so interesting to be on the other side of the event experience because, you know, I'm feeling carefree, and excited, and making tons of connections, and I run into Soleme. And I could just see it in her eyes, the look that I had in my eyes two months ago when I looked at myself in the mirror like an hour before the event was supposed to kick off and I felt like nothing is done and nothing will get done.

And I just empathized with her experience because that is it. Like, you can't punt it to next week, right? Like, there's no procrastination, the plane has to take off. And it does, you know? The plane takes off. But we're also at the eye of the hurricane. And it's important to remember that the attendees craft their own experience as the center of the experience as well, right? So, we feel like everybody's coming in and looking at us to see if this conference is going to be great.

And I'm the same as you. I want to share and so much value that, you know, it feeds the mind and fills the heart, is kind of what we say. Like, we actually care for the person and the professional in the room.

But everybody else is also self-centered. So, it's important to remember that their own experience is going to be customized and crafted the way they see fit. And we can do our best, but we can't please everybody. And that's a big part of the planning, too, is who is here and why? And who shouldn't be here?

And, you know, I read this book recently that talked about the importance of exclusivity in some regard, you know? If you think about it as a party or a family reunion, you know, not everybody gets invited to the family reunion. And that feels like, "Oh, that's kind of not fair." In this world of inclusivity. And I do believe that once you're in the room, you should feel so welcomed, and so cared for, and feel the sense of hospitality, you know, that is just unique.

But in terms of branding, and marketing, and who we're here to serve, we can't serve everybody, you know? So, that's a line I walk in terms of the planning.

So, we've expanded based on some audience analysis this year. Like, we're actually attracting quite a few executives. So, we're going to have an executive track, and technology companies are coming to the party, so we're going to have a tech talk track. And so that's kind of some ways we're thinking of expanding or at least helping people self-select.

PATRICK CASALE: I love that you said because I think that in planning and preparation, understanding your target audience, understanding your marketing on your website, understanding the speakers who you're looking to attract and offer spots to are all really crucial. Because there's a part of me, right? Like, where I'm hosting retreats or summits, and I have a lot of friends in the mental health entrepreneurial space. And I've definitely had a lot of people reach out like, "Hey, how come I haven't been picked to speak yet? Hey, how come, you know, you didn't reach out to me?"

And it's really easy to get cooked to go down that road, too, of like, "I should just invite over people that are friends with me or vice versa." But in reality, you have to think about the audience experience too, and the attendee experience. And it's like, I need to make sure the right people are in the room for exactly what we're trying to accomplish here. And maybe these people might be better suited for an upcoming event or a different event with a different scene or a different level of expertise.

So, that's kind of one of my pieces of preparation and planning, too, is always thinking about the next event. And I think that's important. Like, you mentioned this before we hit record. And I think a lot of people could relate to this, including myself of like, you just hosted this conference, you mentioned the feedback was quite positive. Obviously, there are always things we can improve on. But you are like, "I haven't really been able to take it in, right, because now on to the next thing."

And that can be really challenging for a lot of us who are high achievers or are really looking at to be driven by the next thing that we're creating, if we're visionaries in that way. So, it's really challenging.

And I think that's a part of preparation is like, how do you take it in? How do you absorb what you just put on so that you can go into the next one with as much focus, clarity, confidence, and understanding of what you're trying to accomplish next?

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah. I mean, one way that I learned this year at the end of this conference is there was, you know, we were in the third day, our last day, so things were kind of wrapping up nicely. And so you could take that deep sigh of relief and breath. And we had hired and brought in a somatic kind of breath work professional that people could sit with and experience different things over the, like, 45-minute morning sessions.

And I was sitting in that room where this person was. And she said, "Hey, how are you going to celebrate this?" And I didn't have a great answer at all. I didn't have an answer. I thought, "Oh, celebrate? Like, I'm looking at all the things I need to clean up for next year."

And so we also had these tables of like massage therapists. And I'd never had that experience before in my life. Like, for whatever reason, like, just hadn't done it. And so I was like, "You know what? Okay, let's celebrate. I'm just going to celebrate like this."

And so I got on one of the tables. And it was so relaxing. And I just thought, "That's important to do." Whether it's some small way or, you know, a week off.

The other thing I did was I went to Atlanta. And I hope this turns into a tradition. I went to a race called the Petit Le Mans. It's this kind of, not Formula One, but it's like all these high-performance cars. And it's like a 24-hour race or like 18-hour race. So, you can watch it all night and all day. And it's just a beautiful thing. But it was just kind of an otherworldly experience after having my head in conference mode for 10 or 11 months then to go just watch people race 200 miles an hour around a track.

And I was with my brother. He's like eight or 10 years ahead of me. And he's always dropping these nuggets of wisdom along the way that I remember. And then I'll pick up and then, like, three years later, I'll be like, "Oh, yeah, this one's applicable now."

And right after the conference this year, I got really sick. And he said, "Oh, that's just hero's journey stuff, man. You know, it's like, somehow your body knows sometimes to hold out, whether it's a endurance run or whatever. And then you have to pay those dues. You know, like they collect with interest sometimes."

But he also said, you know, we were talking about venue, and this reminded me of our conversation ahead of this is that he said, "You build your house and then your house builds you." You know, and somebody else famous said that, I don't know.

But he funneled that one to me because we do tend to pick interesting venues. And they have their upsides and downsides, you know? And nothing wrong with a hotel ballroom.

But when it comes to, I think the experience of the outside viewer looking into the conference and seeing what does this conference do, and how do they walk and talk? There's something so fun for me about the venue and the backdrop being unique as a way to influence the branding.

So, actually, our main stage set was this pink and blue kind of Taylor Swift album-looking thing. And that has become our branding going forward for the foreseeable future. And that's another thing that points to planning because in past years we've always tinkered with it, and changed the whole look, and rebranded everything. And this year, I'm like, nope, we're just taking the physical experience into the digital branding experience as a way to just continue to build on what we've done and not reinvent the wheel.

PATRICK CASALE: I love that, all of it, especially, the piece that you're saying where it's like, you've got to be able to take care of yourself after hosting big events like this. There's so much anxiety build-up that you're right. Like, the last day you kind of breathe that sigh of relief you're like, "Okay. I made it."

But I love that that person asked you like what are you doing to celebrate this? Because it's a huge endeavor and undertaking. And there's a reason a lot of people do not pursue hosting big events, and summits, and conferences because of the stress level there on the forefront and throughout.

And that means like, during the process, like you said, once it's here, it's here. You're not getting away from it. You have to answer your questions. You have to troubleshoot. You have to put out fires. You have to have lots of conversations throughout. So, being able to reward yourself in some capacity, whether it's a week of just silence and retreat or a trip to Atlanta, or whatever it's going to be, but trying to take it in because it's so much work. And I hope you were able to do that because that's something that I still actively work on.

And you know, I think for the branding component before we started recording here, or talking about like the summit in Italy, and I was mentioning there are some logistical, I wouldn't call them nightmares, but they're close. They are challenging because it's not like a hotel where if someone wants to upgrade their room or someone wants to change locations, that's an option. And you kind of work with what you have.

But I've always been of the mindset that the experience is the most important piece and that's the part that people will take away the most from. And I think if you have engaging speakers, you mentioned this before, having people who are not just there to speak and then disappear, but people who are going to be attendees, or they're going to be kind of like socializing, and connecting, and answering questions, and just being a part of. I think that's the vibe that we're looking for is like creating this atmosphere where people feel like they are a part of something where they can go and have these conversations where the speakers aren't necessarily like so off limits where you see them once, and you're like, "Ooh, there's that person, I can't talk to them."

And also to really create this, like, local experience, that's what I've always been going for is like travel like a local get off the beaten path. So, I am looking forward to the challenge. And that's all in the preparation and planning stage.

And then the promotion stage was kind of just the videos and the social media posts that I did months before the registration link even opened. So, I think for those of you listening who want to host events, and retreats, and summits, and conferences. Like, there's a lot of promotion, and there's a lot of marketing. And it has to be consistent. I think that's a struggle area for people who I've either coached, or worked with, or alongside who didn't have successful events. It's because they didn't really market it consistently. And I think that is so huge because my marketing was literally just like photography of like the landscapes, the buildings, the food, the people, the interaction stories of what was happening throughout the week, and then my journey. And that really sold itself.

And I think for you, it sounds like you really enjoy the marketing work. Like, actually meeting people, and vendors, and connecting with the audience. And it sounds like maybe Austin is like, "Hey, we need to push some vertical video now for this conference and really start chopping this stuff up into clips." And things like that.

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, yeah, there's lots of ways to get it done. I've certainly learned a lot from Austin. And it's awesome to hear that your marketing and your promotion worked that well and sold it out. And the consistency, it's hard to beat consistency. You know, it's the Bruce Lee quote like, I'm not worried about somebody who does 10,000 moves one time. I'm worried about the person who does one move 10,000 times, you know.

So, we've picked our channel for the past few years as LinkedIn, just given the B2B nature of what we're doing, and the organizations we want to attract. And then this year, in '23 we started Instagram. And we refreshed a Facebook page that just had tumbleweeds rolling across it because there are opportunities but LinkedIn for us has been wonderful.

So, you know, for the small, little mighty team that we are like, we got a good number of followers and it works for us. But you just can't be, something every day, you know, is so much better than one treasured piece you put out that you think is going to move the needle, and you hope it does. And sometimes it does. But more often than not, it's just the get up every morning, and have something scheduled, and say something in a fresh way that you've said before, you know? And, yeah. So, yeah, that's kind of what we've done.

And then the word-of-mouth stuff, as much as we're a marketing-focused conference, you just can't be the person who introduced me to you and the person that you'll introduce me to next and vice versa. You know, I love to connect to people. And that's a two-way street with our community.

And so, I continuously benefit from, "Hey, Steve, you should meet this person." And you know, half the time it's somebody new for me, which is wonderful.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, yeah, I love that. I think that speaks volumes of what you're trying to create, the type of person that you are, and vice versa.

And I think that once you start putting these events on, that work starts to go from a trickle to a ripple to like, a really big effect. And it shows when you're willing to address the areas that maybe you thought could use some improvement, but you're willing to then go back to the drawing board, circle back, improve tweak, pivot, and continue to put events on over and over and over again, and acknowledging like, to yourself like, "I'm about to put my body and my mind through this again. I don't know what the hell's wrong with you. But here we are."

But I really do think it's a cool journey. And for a lot of you listening, I think it's a totally worthwhile opportunity, whether it's a small, you know, weekend retreat, whether it's a conference, whether it's a summit. You know, the sky is the limit here.

And I think that if you have some of these tangible, intangible, like some of these skill sets that come naturally to you, I do think it is a really attainable and approachable avenue. I think that there are lots of ways for mental health professionals and small business owners to use their skills to bring people together, to share some of this vision, to kind of highlight some of these events that are happening.

And I give you a lot of credit, man. When we first met, on your podcast, you told me how you kind of came to be, how you kind of got involved with the Mental Health Marketing Conference. And it sounds like it's become like, just unbelievably part of your passion, and that spark, and the thing that drives you, too.

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, it is. And this year, in January, I did go in full-time. So, that's the other thing is like being in the wild versus having a side hustle, you know, project are two very different things. And so when those challenges come up, there's no other question in my mind except how to solve for this in a creative way that works for everybody involved with the problem. And that's just the benefit of having some skin in the game.

But to one of your other great points there is that your practice, or your business can benefit tremendously from an event because of the marketing that you do. So, the brand awareness that my personal brand has gotten, but also the company brand has gotten as a factor of hosting an event, it's like when you do a webinar, or a podcast, it's like well, X number of people listened to my podcast or webinar, but X times three people saw an impression about me promoting my webinar or podcast.

And so the medium is a little bit of the message there. Whether or not you attend the event I want you to experience a part of it, whether it's video, or the brand impression because you might be at a company next year that's a perfect ideal target, you know, to talk to about my conference.

And so like you do, I play the long game, sacrifice some profit in favor of experience and a return on investment over time, you know, like the snowball effect.

But I do think people underestimate that third P because it seems like oh, now I got to promote this thing? I kind of didn't think about that. That should be in the planning phase, is this is the channel or two that we're going to go hard after almost every day as a way to build my business, in addition to, you know, building this event.

PATRICK CASALE: I'm so happy you said that, the promotion has to be in the plan. And, you know, I run a pretty regular retreat for those who want to host their own successful version of a retreat or an event. And nine times out of 10, the reason I see people struggle is because they didn't promote, they didn't grow an audience, they didn't plan for it.

And a lot of people say, "I hate social media, I just don't want to be on it." I'm like, "Well, your word of mouth, and your connections, and like, offline better be like top-notch then because you do have to get this out there somehow."

And promotion can also be fun. It doesn't always have to feel like this grind because if you really tapped into your ideal client and audience, and you believe in the event that you're hosting, and how it can help them, and what it can do for them, there should be a lot of passion behind the promotion, too.

Like, there are definitely days where I'm like, "I don't want to go sell this spot that someone canceled on for this summit." But if I could circle back to like, but here's what it's going to do for someone long term, here's what it's going to offer, this is why it's different, this is why this is unique, this is why this is a must-do, it takes a lot of the pressure away, it takes a lot of that feeling of like monotony, of like, "It's a chore." And then it becomes fun again. And that's really what I want is like for the passion to shine through in the marketing because the marketing, you're kind of just telling the story and helping your target audience solve their pain points.

And I think that if we can reframe it, it can certainly be a lot more approachable. But I absolutely agree 100%, your promotion really needs to be put together in your planning phase. And you have to plan for that.

Another thing that we were talking about, and I want to mention this to all of you who are thinking about any sort of event hosting and planning, you've got to have the next event in mind because there's no better time to promote your event than when your current event is going on or coming to an end. And people are raving about it. And testimonials are coming out, feedback, and people are talking about it and sharing, that is when your audience is going to be most ready to purchase. And I think that if you're going into an event without one coming into mind for next year, or next quarter, or whatever the case may be, you're doing yourself a big disservice there, too.

STEVE TURNEY: That's so great. That's an opportunity we've missed out on that I know we need to do better. That's so interesting you say that.

And I've thought about it lately in terms of how, like, television networks advertise themselves in the mix. And I don't watch a ton of TV. But like I watch some playoff football and some different things. And you know, right in between the football game, what are they talking about? Well, they're talking about next week's football game on their network. And they're talking about NCIS, or whatever it is, whatever shows that are on their network. And I think that's so smart in the stark, just stoic reality of life, and how things work is that you have to be thinking about the next event. And not just that, but we need to be ready with the next event.

So, I'm happy we've never been earlier. Like, I think our sponsorship deck went out in February, and tickets opened in March, and this year we'll have opened in November for both of those things. So, that's progress. That's what I can celebrate is like, hey, we're getting better at this.

But to go back to like the Behavioral Health Tech conference I went to, I got an email from them, you know, the day I got back, which was, you know, "Fill out our survey and pre-register for next year."

I thought, "Oh, man, that's great. That's an even better way to do it." Or I've seen conferences actually have signage for, you know, the next year's event. I think that's a brilliant way to do it. It's just you have to be ahead of it or I'll get steamrolled, you know? It is how it is.

And like if you're not ahead of it with the planning, you don't get the opportunity always to take advantage of these little blue birds that fly in at the last minute if you don't have the space or the bandwidth to consider everything because you're putting out too many fires. There's always going to be fires. So, like, get used to that. But if you're only wrapped up or consumed with that, then you might miss out on some really magical opportunities that find their way in.

PATRICK CASALE: Absolutely. And I love that you said that. And it's a great example like real time. Okay, you wrap up your conference, you go to this other conference, you immediately get this notification like, "That's how we can improve." Right? And that's the beauty of this is like taking this as market research and figuring out what works, what doesn't, changing as you go.

I know for myself, like, when I first hosted my first Ireland retreat back in 2021, it was so successful that I sold out 2022 before my feet even touched US soil again. And I was just like, "Oh, my God." That ticket is like, the power of FOMO is real, first of all, then just do a good job of highlighting this stuff on social media. Like, that's what people are on social media for. They want to experience, they want to, like, disconnect from their day-to-day, they want to put themselves in that room visually or psychologically.

So, there are lots of good strategies to do this. And I love the idea of just sending out the survey with the link or even promoting it during the event. And that's what we'll often do is like, "Hey, here come the next three events or locations. If you register while you're here, you're going to get an X amount percent discount for being just a loyal attendee." Or whatever the case may be. And that works quite well, too.

It is crazy to me, though, to be thinking about, what are we in? November 2023, I'm already thinking about 2025, all the locations, all the destinations, and it's one of those things that feels like you kind of have to do the next thing, you kind of have to do the next thing, you can't get stale. So, right now we're selling spots for Ireland, March 2025, which feels bizarre and surreal. And people are buying them.

And it's like, well, this is in 19 months. And people are like, "I don't care. I want to come." Like, "Okay, let me get my sales page together."

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, yeah.

PATRICK CASALE: But yeah. I really love this conversation. And I love your take on this. And I think that what you're offering is really cool. It's really unique for the mental health community at large. And just something that's necessary.

You know, we talk so often on this podcast, and in general, about, like, grad school didn't teach a lot of mental health professionals how to run a business. There are so many resources on how to do this. And there are cool experiential ways to get that information, that, you know, you can go to Steve's conference, you can learn all of this from all these industry experts.

And I think that's the unique opportunity here is just the ability to put yourself in a room, to push yourself out of your comfort zone. If you're sitting there like, "Conferences are overwhelming." Or like, "I don't really like to go." It's really important to try to take that risk, push yourself out of that comfort zone. You never know who you're going to meet, you never know who you're going to connect with. And the experiences are going to last a lifetime.

So, Steve, I really appreciate you coming on and sharing this. And kudos to you and everything that you're doing. It's really impressive. And congratulations. And I know that 2024 is going to be an awesome opportunity as well.

For everyone that's listening, where can they find more of the Mental Health Marketing Conference so that they can register as soon as they listen to this episode?

STEVE TURNEY: Yeah, thank you, Patrick. I find a lot of affinity with you and our conversations. And I learn from you, which I always value, and enjoy our conversations.

So, the website is M as in mental, H as in healthmarketing. So, mhmarketing.org, O-R-G. And by the time this podcast is live, we'll have tickets up and active. We're doing a discount, specifically, for All Things Private Practice that you can find the links below.

And yeah, thanks for having me on this show. I hope to do it again. And I'm excited to have you on THE BOOST, my podcast in a couple few weeks, I think. I'm looking forward to that, too.

PATRICK CASALE: Me too, man. I really appreciate it. And I'm looking forward to coming back on and hopefully, my recording goes well this time. My sound folks did not like the audio apparently.

But yeah, I will have all of Steve's information in the show notes for all of you to have easy access to. You'll be able to easily access the Mental Health Marketing Conference so that you can sign up, register, I think it's in October of next year, of 2024. So, keep an eye out for that. I think it's going to be a really awesome opportunity in Tennessee.

So, thanks again for coming on and making the time. It's really always great to talk with you.

STEVE TURNEY: For sure, thanks so much.

PATRICK CASALE: And to everyone listening to the All Things Private Practice podcast, new episodes are up every single Saturday on all major platforms and YouTube. You can like, comment, subscribe, and share. Doubt yourself, do it anyway. We'll see you next week. Thanks, Steve.