Show Notes

In this episode, Patrick Casale talks with Mim Kempson, a neurodivergent therapist, relationship expert, and now, stand-up comedian making bold moves from Australia to Montreal.

Mim offers a raw take on embracing neurodivergence and designing life—and business—around personal strengths and values. Her journey is proof that our differences can become our superpowers, whether in the therapy room or on a comedy stage.

Here are 3 key takeaways:

1. Context is Everything: Success as a neurodivergent professional often depends less on “fixing” ourselves and more on finding (or creating) environments where we thrive.
2. Leaning Into Discomfort Spurs Growth: Mim’s willingness to embrace discomfort, navigate big moves, and take creative risks led to new fulfillment in both her clinical and comedic careers.
3. You Don’t Have to Fit Into One Box: Therapists (and all of us) are more than just one role—exploring multiple passions can lead to richer careers and lives.

“When you put a neurodivergent person in the right context, there’s very little we can’t face.” – Mim Kempson

More about Mim:

Mim Kempson (she/her) is an AuDHD Therapist and has run her private practice in Australia for over 6 years, specializing in sex and relationship therapy for neurodivergent adults and couples. As a multi-passionate AuDHDer herself, Mim recently moved to Montreal to pursue her dream in standup comedy. Mim now runs her therapy and coaching practice fully online, seeing clients internationally.

• Mim is launching a private podcast (subscription-based) called “Therapy After Hours” which will be about honouring our own needs through navigating the transition from 2025 into a new year. Check out her Instagram for more information.
• Instagram: instagram.com/mimkempsonofficial
• Website: mimkempson.com

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Transcript

PATRICK CASALE: Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the All Things Private Practice podcast, joined today by Mim Kempson. She is an AuDHD therapist and has her own private practice in Australia for over six years, specializing in sex and relationship therapy for neurodivergent adults and couples.

As a multi-passionate AuDHDer herself, Mim recently moved to Montreal to pursue her dream and stand-up comedy. Mim now runs her therapy and coaching practices fully online, seeing clients internationally.

Super cool, by the way. Think that was the reason, I mean, I like your content. And I follow it anyway. But I was like, “Damn, this would be a cool story to hear.” So, I appreciate you coming on and making the time. 

MIM KEMPSON: Thank you. It's the first time I've been on a podcast talking about the comedy side of myself. So, I'm quite excited as well.

PATRICK CASALE: Okay, so first time talking about this on a podcast. How's that feeling to just sit with that right now, to say I moved all the way across the world to pursue this?

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, well, many feelings, because I'm such a beginner. Obviously, it takes time to build experience and confidence in this space. So, I'm trying to enjoy being in the exploration and play of it. Yeah, very much where I'm at.

PATRICK CASALE: Okay, cool, yeah. That has to be such a vulnerable experience of standing up there and just feeling perceived as someone with a sensitive nervous system. How is that for you to just put yourself out there in that type of way?

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, well, I am also a public speaker or workshop facilitator, and writer. So, getting on stage wasn't completely foreign, but it's very different, the craft of jokes. Like, having to drop a punchline, the technical rule is every 15 to 45 seconds is the expectation of stand-up, whereas before I'd crack jokes a couple of times in an hour-long presentation. So, I wouldn't necessarily call it pressure, it's more like the goal is very different, right?

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, that's an interesting fact. I would not have been aware of that. I know when I'm doing public speaking, I try to make fun of myself the entire time to, like, help myself just kind of, like, drop into the experience. If I can get some people laughing, then I'm like, “Okay, I feel like I'm in a good space right now.” If you say something and it doesn't land, and everyone's just sitting there staring at you, you're like, “Oh, fuck, maybe I've got to try something different.” But that's really fascinating. 

So, why Montreal? Like, how do you end up going from Australia to Montreal? What's the pull there? What's the connection?

MIM KEMPSON: I lived here 10 years ago, when I was studying journalism. So, many years before I became a therapist and found out that I'm neurodivergent. And I went to university here for two semesters. So, I lived here a year. 

And I fell in love with the place. It felt more aligned with who I am than any city I've lived in in Australia. So, it was always my dream to return, but it's harder at 31 versus 21, I think I was at the time. A lot more to juggle, especially being self-employed. It has its own freedoms, but also many constraints, especially with licensing as a therapist, and tax, and registering my business, which, as an ADHDer, those are complete barriers, because I'm like, “Fuck that. That's boring. I don't want to figure that out.” 

So, the way I did it was there was just too many barriers to me pulling the trigger and moving. I just came here on holiday, like six, seven months ago. And I just spontaneously was like, “No, I'm meant to be here.” And so, I canceled my return flight, figured out the visa stuff, and just stayed.

PATRICK CASALE: Wow, sometimes we need that pressure, right? As ADHDers to get the task done that feels really overwhelming, or daunting, or boring. And I can totally relate. And I know a lot of people listening can too with their business stuff. They're like, “This is boring. I'm going to do something else until it's last minute.” And then, that pressure kind of helps us at least see the job through. So, I can totally relate to that. 

Okay, so that's fascinating to me. You figure out later in life that you are AuDHD, you're a therapist, and a coach, and a writer, and a speaker, and a consultant. How does that all kind of play a role now in terms of, like, how you see Mim today versus pre-discovery and diagnosis? Like, what are the big shifts?

MIM KEMPSON: Wow, big question. How do I start? I think the thing I love about self-employment is it's very much a mosaic of all my special interests, and skills, and ways that I want to contribute to the world, that I get to tailor, and pick, and choose. 

And I absolutely love therapy and being a therapist, because I get that one-on-one deep connection where I'm just fully present with people. And my attention to detail, pattern recognition, intensity of curiosity is so celebrated. Like, I feel more myself being a therapist at work than I do in the wild, often.

And comedy is somewhat shaping up to be that as well. Like, there's a lot that is new and different that's taking an adjustment. But something I've learned in my work with clients and my own personal experience is often the issue isn't like this is obvious. It's not our own neurodivergence. And there's a lot of languaging around it being a deficiency, and struggle, and that sort of language minimizes us in our potential and what we actually thrive in. 

And so, when you put an AuDHDer or an autistic person in the right context, there's actually very little problems we can't face. And that's what I've experienced. When I'm honoring the way my brain works, what my values are, who I am as a person, and where I want to be headed, it's not to say it's easy, but challenges become a lot more manageable because I'm in context.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, I think that's a really important point, is the environment matters. I think that being able to have the right supports and structure set up for yourself to be successful because you're right. So often, when we're talking about autism, when we're talking about ADHD, we're talking about it from a deficit-based lens. We are talking about it from a pathologizing place of here are all the ways this person is going to struggle for the rest of their life. 

And if you only hear that, that is so demoralizing. It can feel like, “Okay, so what's the point?” Then there's something clearly really wrong with me here. And not to say that there aren't people who are going to struggle significantly for the rest of their lives in most scenarios based on support needs, but I think it's a really important piece to highlight the strengths, to highlight the other side of the coin so that it doesn't feel like this like “death sentence” to be diagnosed as autistic or ADHD, which I think society can sometimes paint that picture of like, “Okay, you're 31 Mim, you're autistic now, and your life's going to be fucking tragic.” And, you know, how can we move through the rest of our lives if that's our belief about ourselves, and about our abilities, and about how we can overcome things.

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, I mean, even when you say that, like, I feel my heart just drop. It's heavy when we see it that way. But if we say, well, I just haven't yet found the environment, or the supports, or the surrounding community, and people that honor and celebrate who I am, like that's way more filled with hope and potential.

PATRICK CASALE: Absolutely. And like you mentioned, just the way the brain works so creatively outside of the box, and how a lot of us as neurodivergent humans see the world so differently and sometimes with so much intensity, which can really lead to beautiful creation in terms of whether it is writing or whether it is, I assume, a comedy show, or just a creative venture. It can feel like that flow state is just such an exhilarating feeling. 

I know I spend a lot of time chasing that feeling, because I know how fleeting it is for me, at least. I know when I am in deep focus, I feel so alive. And I'm like, “Oh my God.” I am just like creating, I'm writing. Like, things are just flying off the page and out of my brain. 

And then, oftentimes, it's sluggish. I'm like, trying to find it. I'm trying to find that spark. I'm like, seeking it out at all costs. Do you experience that, especially given the fact that you are now living in a city where you mentioned before we started recording, it's freezing and snowing all the time?

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah. And it's also very overstimulating, because it's a big city where the buildings are built for, like, keeping in the heat, but not so much sound. So, I'm like, hearing all the things all the time. And there's no nature. I could rabbit on about this forever. But there are pros and cons to anywhere we live. And the reality is, if I want to be getting opportunities to speak on stage every night of the week, if I wanted, Montreal is the sort of place I need to be.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah. So, it's a sacrifice in a way. It's like an exchange of, you're going to never find the perfect place, although my ADHD likes to convince me that I will sometimes. Like, it'll just be better over here, or it'll be easier over here, or how romanticized I can make things in terms of like, but if I just lived in New Zealand for the next year, life would be pretty amazing, which I personally believe it would be. 

But I agree with you wholeheartedly. And I think that's important for those of you listening to here is like, I think sometimes it is we are looking at the pros and cons of situations. And where can we set ourselves up, not only for success, but you keep kind of alluding to values alignment. Like, where can I be where I am aligned and I feel anchored in to my values and the things that I want to pursue and the things that I feel good about? And I think there could be a lot worse places to choose in the world than Canada. 

I was mentioning to you, I went to school near Montreal. And I took it for granted. I was not a savvy traveler at the time, nor did I really care about the culture. And I would really like to get back to Montreal and to Quebec for those reasons. And it was a really, really beautiful area and part of the country when I was up there. 

And I do think that I could deal with the cold, but the overstimulation of the big city atmosphere would really be a struggle for me. Like, where I live, we probably have 90,000 people total here in the mountains of Carolina. And that feels like too many for me. I think I would prefer a place where it was maybe like 5000. So, I think you just have to kind of figure out what you can do in terms of supporting your needs and your sensory needs, too, especially.

MIM KEMPSON: And I see life in chapters where our needs change, and our goals, and our direction. Like, it's not a path we can plan as much as some of us may like to. And right now, it fits me best. 

But I think, with any of these things, like self-employment, pursuing our dreams, living in particular locations, they all come with compromise. And I think all of us as humans will try and find a magical way that has no compromise. But how I work as a therapist is often we lay out the compromises straight up, of okay, you want this in life. What's it going to look like in terms of the costs, the risks, the sacrifices you'll have to make? And are you okay with that? Because if we keep pretending they don't exist, that's when shit never happens. We just lay dormant in our own life.

PATRICK CASALE: That's true. That's really well said. It's very, very, very true. Thinking about moving and living abroad, a lot of you listening are probably something that is of interest to you, especially as what's going on in our country is happening on a daily basis. How do you feel dealing with like the 18-hour time differences every day with your clients?

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, I've been surprised at how I've made it work. Like, at the beginning, I was getting up at 5:30 in the morning to see clients at 6:00 AM in Australia. And now it's 7:00 or 8:00 AM because everywhere in the world has different daylight savings, changeovers. So, I have to pivot every time that happens. 

And I actually didn't mind it, because I’d get up early, I'd see clients. And strangely, there's at least for my brain, what happens is it's a completely clean slate where I can be fully there for clients, because nothing's happened in my day to throw me. And it's an advantage. And then, I'm like, done by 9:00 AM and can work on other things like writing comedy, or doing social media, or it's like the inverse of 9:00 to 5:00, pretty much.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, I know when I was in New Zealand in April, I would wake up, I would like check my phone. It would be 4:00 or 5:00 PM over here, people are getting through their day, and by the time I would eat lunch, everybody was going to bed. And I was like, “I don't have to look at my phone ever again.”

And I remember thinking, like, “This is a really cool way to live.” Because I experienced 24/7 anxiety all the time. And being over there was one of the first times I did not. And I think had a lot to do with, like, exactly what you're saying, starting with a clean slate, and just being able to get on with my day without being worried about what was going on over here. 

So, I really appreciated that. And that was really nice change of reference for me. But I met a lot of Australians in New Zealand who are like, “I would move to New Zealand over Australia any day of the week. What are your thoughts on that?”

MIM KEMPSON: Interesting. Well, I haven't been to New Zealand. It's definitely on my list, especially for the nature. So, I couldn't say, but at this point, Canada definitely has my heart more than Australia.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah. And will you make the trip back, or are you staying in Canada for the foreseeable future without plans to return? 

MIM KEMPSON: Well, the sheer distance. Like, it's a 32-hour flight, depending on how many connections you have. So, if I can avoid that, I think that's my current plan.

PATRICK CASALE: 32 hours. Yeah, I would avoid it as well.

Okay, so going back to the comedy piece, what are the things that you have found to be really exciting or exhilarating when it comes to putting yourself in this position, to kind of pursue one of these dreams and goals?

MIM KEMPSON: Well, you know, I think most of us are pretty aware that comedy probably attracts a lot of neurodivergent people. It's really the perfect setting in so many ways, and yet, there are lots of challenges. 

So, sensory-wise, like the lights, the noise, the interruptions from audience members, the late nights, the lack of control you have, there's a lot that can be dysregulating that I have to have pretty firm boundaries around, especially with myself, in order to rock up and feel regulated. But comedy is a very meticulous craft. So, depending on how much listeners know about stand-up, usually word for word, things are crafted with such intentionality, because the art is about timing and the sort of musicality of words. 

And so, when you drop a punchline, usually, it's on the final… I'm getting into like details already, but it's like on the final word of the sentence. And so, the structure is amazing for an autistic brain, because you're literally writing a script that you follow on stage. You get to have such fun crafting with words. And it's about like the delivery, which you rehearse, and practice, and repeat over and over until you find what works. So, there's like safety and comfort in that. 

But the side, like you alluded to earlier, where you're putting yourself in front of a whole public group of people to be perceived, my first experience in… So, I did a six-week comedy course where we'd go and present our material, and then the teacher would pick it apart and give us really great feedback. 

And we were all just meeting each other for the first time. And the material I brought to class it's like a three-minute set. That's not very long. I was completely misunderstood. Like, the jokes that I told did not represent who I am. I realized after the fact. And people from, like, what I was hearing from everyone, and even just looking at the faces in the audience of my classmates, I was like, “Oh shit, I have not encapsulated who I am in this short period of time.” And that's, obviously, for so many of us, one of our worst fears. 

And so, I felt this pressure to get things right. And then, my perfectionism doubled down. And I spent a couple of weeks feeling somewhat paralyzed or resistant to getting back up there. And I workshopped my persona and the jokes that I was telling, and eventually realized that I was joking about the wrong thing. I was joking about, like you alluded to, with way you present is the self-deprecation, making fun of ourselves. I was doing it in a way that made me feel bad about myself, not laughing with people, but people were laughing at me, which I was doing to myself. So, through that journey, I am starting to shape up what I want that persona to be.

PATRICK CASALE: That's a great point. I think that's such a subtle difference, too, of like people laughing at me, or I'm laughing with them about what I'm saying. And yeah, talk about two different emotional responses to those things, too. 

And it sounds like just as you're learning more about yourself, getting more and more and more comfortable about who you are on stage as well, and what feels really comfortable and natural for you too. And I'm sure there's a lot of trial and error, and a lot of like throwing things against the wall and seeing what works and what doesn't.

MIM KEMPSON: So much. And it's part of the process, which I think is a really great exercise for so many of us, neurodivergent folks, who are scared of rejection, and failure, and making mistakes, and things not going according to plan. Literally, all of that happens. So, it's building my muscle of handling that.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, that's well said. What about like heckling? Does that still [CROSSTALK 00:24:37]-

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, that's my worst nightmares. I haven't experienced that yet, but probably just like any autistic person, I would plan a series of responses I could whip out of my pocket at any time if caught unaware, because there was this exercise we were doing in class where Rodney, our teacher, got us to go up on the stage. And we all pretended to be hecklers. And we had to practice responding on the spot. 

I never got up and did it, but you just had to be, not only so quick, but like almost mean, because you have to show them that you have the upper hand, but then, it has to be in line with the persona, because if you're out of character, that's going to throw the audience. So, I can't report on that just yet.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, that sounds like the thing I would get stuck on. And, yeah, I think that would be a challenge. But I've always thought about comedy, especially for autistic people. There's so many good autistic comedians because of, like, delivery and how things just come across, like, exactly as they are. And people often laugh at things I'm saying that I don't mean to be funny. I'm just saying it, you know, with, like, maybe a deadpan delivery. I'm just like, “Yeah, here is the information. This is my thought.” And then, people are laughing. And I'm like, “Damn, maybe I should try comedy at some point in time.”

But mine is not scripted. And I have a hard time scripting stuff. I always struggle. Like, even when I talk about autism in general, I'm like, I don't really script a lot of conversation or response. And I've always found that fascinating, even like the TEDx that I did a couple of months ago, you know, everything has to be scripted, everything has to be verbatim. And you have to go off script. And that was such a hard thing for me to get used to. 

And I must have rehearsed that thing like a thousand times. And I just think that if you're able to, like, fall into that and get comfortable with that, then it would make that process probably a little bit easier as well. And it sounds like just finding your groove as you go, which I really love hearing. 

And you know, we always want to highlight on here, like people who are doing things differently, people who are, yeah, they're therapists, maybe they're mental health professionals, but they have so many other interests that they're pursuing and just showcasing that like we don't have to stay confined to the one-on-one therapy office or the therapy chair. And there are so many ways that we can pursue the things that we're passionate about. 

So, congrats to you for just literally up and doing it and moving across the world to pursue something that you're really passionate about.

MIM KEMPSON: Thank you. Yeah. I mean, there's so much I could say to that, but it is, I don't even know. I'll leave it with you if you have a question, but I'm also conscious of your time.

PATRICK CASALE: No, it's okay. Yeah. So, I know you are coming up with a podcast. I think you mentioned that. So, we always want to give space to our guests to kind of share a little bit about what you've got going on, where they can find you, and we'll include it in the show notes as well, so that everyone has access to whatever Mim is about to cite.

MIM KEMPSON: Awesome. Yes, I am launching a private podcast called Therapy After Hours, because I realized a lot of what I speak about on my Instagram in these like 30-second reels, I could dive far deeper into, because every week, as a therapist, I hear what people behind the scenes are going through. And so many of us think it's just us struggling in that specific way, but it really isn't. And so, creating 20 to 30-minute episodes where I go into specific topics like, what are feelings? How do we identify them? How do we express them effectively in our relationships? Are things that we kind of skim over. And so, I'm going to be chunking down these topics that we all need to hear. And it's like a course, but without the order, so you can listen to episodes in whatever order you like. 

PATRICK CASALE: Nice. Yeah. I like that idea. Yeah, trying to get any amount of information into a 30 to 60-second reel. And like, then I always struggle with the comments of, like, “That's not right, or that's not accurate, or no, you're missing this point.” And I'm like, “This was 45 seconds. Of course, I'm missing that point. Like, that's the whole point of fucking social media. Like, that's the exact point of putting out a content like this.” So, that is always a frustration of mine. Para social relationships are weird.

MIM KEMPSON: They're so weird. 

PATRICK CASALE: They’re so weird.

MIM KEMPSON: And it's like, it's so funny, because obviously, like, I love my fellow neurodivergent people. But the irony of being neurodivergent is like, especially for autistics, they're fact-checking all the fucking time. And they're like, “You missed this context and this detail.” And I'm like, “As you say, I'm very aware of that. I couldn't fit it all into a caption in 45 seconds.”

PATRICK CASALE: Yep, yep, yeah. Social media is a blessing and curse. And it's a rough place to be sometimes. But I think when you're growing an audience, it's comical to me. And I always laugh about it off. Like, sometimes I'm like, very frustrated by it. But yeah, some of the comments, I'm like, “Yeah, of course, I couldn't get that into a 60-second clip. Like, this is a whole hour-long episode.” 

And I'll often, like, share the link of being like, “Here's the hour-long episode that I talked about this on this other podcast. Here you go.” And are like, “I'm not going to listen to that.” I’m like, “Okay, sorry. Like, I don't know what to tell you.”

MIM KEMPSON: Yeah, I can relate to that a lot. But that is the idea of there will be a longer episode available on the topics I speak of, if people are interested, which, yeah, I'll be starting to talk about on my Instagram this week.

PATRICK CASALE: Solid. Well, we will include your Instagram link in the show notes and information about that podcast and everything else that you've kind of mentioned. So, I just want to thank you for coming on, and making the time, and sharing a little bit of your story on here. 

MIM KEMPSON: Thank you so much, Patrick.

PATRICK CASALE: And to everyone listening to All Things Private Practice, new episodes are out on Saturdays on all major platforms and YouTube. Like, download, subscribe, share. Doubt yourself, do it anyway. See you next week.